Utopia Talk - Politics - Tesla sales plunge

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Utopia Talk / Politics / Tesla sales plunge

murder
Member Wed Apr 02 17:33:27
Tesla sales plunge: Biggest decline in its history

Tesla sales plunged 13% in the first three months of this year, the largest drop in deliveries in its history, as backlash against CEO Elon Musk and growing competition took a large bite out of demand for its EVs.

Tesla reported Wednesday that it delivered 336,681 cars in the quarter, 50,000 fewer vehicles compared to the first three months of last year. The results were the company’s worst sales in nearly three years.

Tesla has faced protests outside its showrooms from those opposed to the actions of Musk in one of his other roles as the head of the Department of Government Efficiency, and the policies of Donald Trump’s presidential administration. There have also been instances of vandalism against Tesla facilities, including its charging stations, as well as some cars. All these incidents may have discouraged some potential Tesla buyers from going ahead with their purchases.

Tesla did not mention the protests against the company in its sales statement. It did, however, point to an update to the Model Y during the quarter that temporarily halted production at all four of its factories for several weeks.

“Thank you to all our customers, employees, suppliers, shareholders and supporters who helped us achieve these results,” the company said.

The decline is stunning for a company that until recently was reporting year-over-year sales growth of between 20% and 100% virtually every quarter, a rate greatly responsible for its lofty stock price. Tesla’s first modest drop in quarterly sales only occurred in 2020 during the pandemic when shutdowns hit production and deliveries.

But last year, Tesla reported its first annual decline in sales, which accelerated in the first quarter. The plunge was worse than expected by Tesla analysts, who had forecast quarterly sales as low as 350,000.Then

Tesla shares, which nearly doubled in value after the presidential election on hopes that Musk’s close ties to Trump would result in policies that were advantageous to the company, have lost 44% of their value since hitting an all-time high in December. Shares of Tesla (TSLA) fell about 2% in early trading following the sales report, but rebounded sharply on a Politico report that Musk will be stepping back from his formal role in the Trump administration but may stay on as an informal adviser.

Musk ‘brand tornado crisis’ hits sales

Analysts continue to worry that Musk’s actions elsewhere are hurting Tesla.

“The Street and us knew a bad 1Q was coming but this was even worse than expected,” said Dan Ives of Wedbush Securities, who has been a bull on Tesla, in a note to clients Wednesday. “This quarter was an example of the damage Musk is causing Tesla. This continues to be a moment of truth for Musk to navigate this brand tornado crisis and get onto the other side of this dark chapter for Tesla.”

With his high profile, confrontational statements and postings on social media, Musk has become a lightning rod for people opposed to the policies of the Trump administration.

A CNN poll last month found just 35% of Americans express a positive view of Musk, with 53% rating him negatively, making him both better known and more substantially unpopular than Vice President JD Vance (whom 33% of Americans rate favorably and 44% unfavorably.)

Those negative opinions of Musk are bleeding over into negative views of Tesla, especially among those who identify as liberals. Those Americans are a segment of the car buying market most likely to be interested in buying a green electric vehicle.

And polling indicates Tesla is losing favor. A February poll by Morning Consult shows that nearly 32% of US buyers “would not consider” buying a Tesla. That’s up from 27% in a Morning Consult survey a year ago, and 17% in 2021.

S&P Global Mobility, which tracks sales on a state-by-state basis, said there has been a big change in customer loyalty between so-called “blue states,” which have voted for a Democrat in the last four presidential elections, and “red states” where Republicans won.

In blue states, the percentage of current Tesla owners buying another Tesla fell to 65% at the end of 2024 from 72% the year before. Meanwhile, repeat Tesla buyers in red states edged up very slightly from 47.6% to 48.2% during the same time period.

Problems with sales outside United States

Tesla does not break out its sales by market. But sales fell 49% in Europe alone in the first two months of the quarter, according to the European Automobile Manufacturers’ Association, even as EV sales overall grew 28% on the continent.

That may be due to opposition to Musk in Europe, thanks to his vocal support of far-right political parties in Germany and the United Kingdom.

But even without the political controversy, Tesla is facing headwinds due to growing competition from other automakers, particularly those in China.

China is the largest market for EVs and Tesla’s second largest market, after the United States. Chinese automaker BYD reported sales of more than 416,000 pure electric passenger vehicles in the quarter, a 39% rise from a year earlier, once again overtaking Tesla as the world’s largest seller of EVs.

BYD has pulled ahead ahead of Tesla in EV sales for a number of quarters in recent years, although Tesla has always maintained the lead in full-year sales. But Tesla is poised to lose that title in 2025, given current sales trends.

BYD’s EVs are generally less expensive than Tesla, among other advantages. Earlier this month, BYD unveiled a charging system that it says will give its latest EV model 250 miles of range after plugging in for just five minutes.

But despite the competition abroad, BYD and most other Chinese EV makers do not have a presence in the US market.

This story has been updated with additional reporting and context.

CNN’s Ariel Edwards-Levy, Juliana Liu, Hassan Tayir and John Liu contributed to this report.

Correction: An earlier version of this story incorrectly stated the decline in Tesla sales. Tesla sales fell 13% last quarter.

http://www...usiness/tesla-sales/index.html

williamthebastard
Member Wed Apr 02 17:50:53
"most other Chinese EV makers do not have a presence in the US market."

That was a weird way of saying that there are 27% tarrifs on Chinese cars in the US

williamthebastard
Member Wed Apr 02 17:53:19
Sorry, 100% tariffs

"it is effectively barred from due to 100% tariffs on its passenger cars."

Sam Adams
Member Thu Apr 03 10:23:09
"BYD’s EVs are generally less expensive than Tesla"

Only if you compare little foreign shitboxes to proper vehicles. If you compare byds to other vehicles in the same class the prices are the same.

jergul
large member Thu Apr 03 10:25:53
Defunding Musk remains the Humanity's prime directive. Citizen Trump is playing his heavy handed part in this.

jergul
large member Thu Apr 03 10:26:13
Strike the "the".

Sam Adams
Member Thu Apr 03 10:28:57
But ya tesla has obviously made major mistakes. The gimmicky shit, the lack of flat roofs and spares, no v2x, no real truck, insane leader, the fsd lies makes it clear they are not headed for a rosy future. Ford GM and Rivian would all be well ahead of tesla in terms of useful EVs that i am looking at. Maybe even hyndai/volvo. Surprising to see the japanese failing at EVs.

Nimatzo
iChihuaha Thu Apr 03 13:26:01
It’s all about SpaceX. Always was. And I bet that is what Musk is getting out of his relationship with Trump and setting Tesla on fire.

williamthebastard
Member Thu Apr 03 16:20:47
Excellent, about bloody time.

"European Union regulators are preparing major penalties against Elon Musk’s social media platform X for breaking a landmark law to combat illicit content and disinformation.

The fine could surpass $1 billion, one person said, as regulators seek to make an example of X to deter other companies from violating the law, called the Digital Services Act.

E.U. officials said their investigation into X was progressing independently from tariff negotiations after Mr. Trump announced major new levies this week. The investigation began in 2023 and regulators last year issued a preliminary ruling that X had violated the law.

X also faces a second E.U. investigation that is broader and that could lead to further penalties. In that investigation, two people said, E.U. officials are building a case that X’s hands-off approach to policing user-generated content has made it a hub of illegal hate speech, disinformation and other material that is viewed as undercutting democracy across the 27-nation bloc.

X declined to comment.

The X investigation has been closely watched as the first major attempt to enforce the Digital Services Act, which requires companies to better police their platforms and to provide adequate transparency about how their services work.

https://archive.ph/https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/03/technology/eu-penalties-x-elon-musk.html

williamthebastard
Member Thu Apr 03 16:21:11
http://www.../eu-penalties-x-elon-musk.html

kargen
Member Thu Apr 03 17:16:08
what makes you think Musk is getting out of his relationship with Trump?

murder
Member Thu Apr 03 19:02:43

He's not. It wouldn't make a difference, and Trump is his main lifeline.

Seb
Member Thu Apr 03 19:14:34
Sam:

"Only if you compare little foreign shitboxes to proper vehicles"

Given we are talking Tesla, which produces vehicles that spontaneously catch fire, drive into trailers, lock their drivers in during an accident, aren't deemed roadworthy in many countries and whose latest product is currently subject to recall in its home market due to being glued together with defective glue... I'm not sure proper vehicle is quite the opposite term.

Seb
Member Thu Apr 03 19:28:01
As for spaceX, I'm starting to revise my view on starship. They've cut the payload dramatically, and several of the last launches have failed due to problems they already knew about from the previous failure but couldn't address due to production cycles.

They are, essentially, hitting the point where fast iterative learning doesn't work because the build times are too long and it's too hard to change design.

To keep their methodology they need to slow down tests; or they need to start to move towards NASA style lab by tests, scaled model tests etc.

It's starting to look to independent experts who championed falcon that starship may be a turkey. Fundamentally to heavy and not enough safety margin, and not enough free parameters in its design to find a sweet spot that gives reliable success rates and reusability.

And I think they're kinda fundamentally curtailed starlinks market share by weaponising it. Further the model of huge numbers of Leo sats is likely a liability. Recent studies indicate the high rate of satellite re-entries and associated Al compounds aerosolised in the high atmosphere is likely to result in depletion of ozone.

I suspect in the medium term this will result in some kind of regulatory or consumer pushback.

Sam Adams
Member Thu Apr 03 20:24:34
"Given we are talking Tesla, which produces vehicles that spontaneously catch fire, drive into trailers, lock their drivers in during an accident, aren't deemed roadworthy in many countries and whose latest product is currently subject to recall in its home market due to being glued together with defective glue"

The funny thing is this though: after all that its still a superior vehicle to anything made in britain, ever, by far. I'd include the EU too but some of the latest volvos look decent.

murder
Member Thu Apr 03 21:33:35

"As for spaceX, I'm starting to revise my view on starship. They've cut the payload dramatically, and several of the last launches have failed due to problems they already knew about from the previous failure but couldn't address due to production cycles."

I imagine that they will get that thing into orbit eventually, but I don't see a moon landing in their future.

-

Seb
Member Fri Apr 04 01:41:11
"A cybertruck is better than a Roles or a Bentley".

Sure Sam. Sure.

Seb
Member Fri Apr 04 01:44:16
Murder:

Probably, but it's going to be well outside the original parameters as a reusable by the sounds of it. Basically the gist of the last good article I read, they are having to sacrifice far too much payload for fuel and at the same time cutting engineering safety margins.

Seb
Member Fri Apr 04 03:15:00
I can totally understand how Americans might argue that they have some amazing artisanal cheese or beers. Sam is arguing bud lite and a slice of velveeta is better than a Paulaner or brie de meaux.

This says more about his taste and standards.

show deleted posts

murder Member	Wed Apr 02 17:33:27 Tesla sales plunge: Biggest decline in its history Tesla sales plunged 13% in the first three months of this year, the largest drop in deliveries in its history, as backlash against CEO Elon Musk and growing competition took a large bite out of demand for its EVs. Tesla reported Wednesday that it delivered 336,681 cars in the quarter, 50,000 fewer vehicles compared to the first three months of last year. The results were the company’s worst sales in nearly three years. Tesla has faced protests outside its showrooms from those opposed to the actions of Musk in one of his other roles as the head of the Department of Government Efficiency, and the policies of Donald Trump’s presidential administration. There have also been instances of vandalism against Tesla facilities, including its charging stations, as well as some cars. All these incidents may have discouraged some potential Tesla buyers from going ahead with their purchases. Tesla did not mention the protests against the company in its sales statement. It did, however, point to an update to the Model Y during the quarter that temporarily halted production at all four of its factories for several weeks. “Thank you to all our customers, employees, suppliers, shareholders and supporters who helped us achieve these results,” the company said. The decline is stunning for a company that until recently was reporting year-over-year sales growth of between 20% and 100% virtually every quarter, a rate greatly responsible for its lofty stock price. Tesla’s first modest drop in quarterly sales only occurred in 2020 during the pandemic when shutdowns hit production and deliveries. But last year, Tesla reported its first annual decline in sales, which accelerated in the first quarter. The plunge was worse than expected by Tesla analysts, who had forecast quarterly sales as low as 350,000.Then Tesla shares, which nearly doubled in value after the presidential election on hopes that Musk’s close ties to Trump would result in policies that were advantageous to the company, have lost 44% of their value since hitting an all-time high in December. Shares of Tesla (TSLA) fell about 2% in early trading following the sales report, but rebounded sharply on a Politico report that Musk will be stepping back from his formal role in the Trump administration but may stay on as an informal adviser. Musk ‘brand tornado crisis’ hits sales Analysts continue to worry that Musk’s actions elsewhere are hurting Tesla. “The Street and us knew a bad 1Q was coming but this was even worse than expected,” said Dan Ives of Wedbush Securities, who has been a bull on Tesla, in a note to clients Wednesday. “This quarter was an example of the damage Musk is causing Tesla. This continues to be a moment of truth for Musk to navigate this brand tornado crisis and get onto the other side of this dark chapter for Tesla.” With his high profile, confrontational statements and postings on social media, Musk has become a lightning rod for people opposed to the policies of the Trump administration. A CNN poll last month found just 35% of Americans express a positive view of Musk, with 53% rating him negatively, making him both better known and more substantially unpopular than Vice President JD Vance (whom 33% of Americans rate favorably and 44% unfavorably.) Those negative opinions of Musk are bleeding over into negative views of Tesla, especially among those who identify as liberals. Those Americans are a segment of the car buying market most likely to be interested in buying a green electric vehicle. And polling indicates Tesla is losing favor. A February poll by Morning Consult shows that nearly 32% of US buyers “would not consider” buying a Tesla. That’s up from 27% in a Morning Consult survey a year ago, and 17% in 2021. S&P Global Mobility, which tracks sales on a state-by-state basis, said there has been a big change in customer loyalty between so-called “blue states,” which have voted for a Democrat in the last four presidential elections, and “red states” where Republicans won. In blue states, the percentage of current Tesla owners buying another Tesla fell to 65% at the end of 2024 from 72% the year before. Meanwhile, repeat Tesla buyers in red states edged up very slightly from 47.6% to 48.2% during the same time period. Problems with sales outside United States Tesla does not break out its sales by market. But sales fell 49% in Europe alone in the first two months of the quarter, according to the European Automobile Manufacturers’ Association, even as EV sales overall grew 28% on the continent. That may be due to opposition to Musk in Europe, thanks to his vocal support of far-right political parties in Germany and the United Kingdom. But even without the political controversy, Tesla is facing headwinds due to growing competition from other automakers, particularly those in China. China is the largest market for EVs and Tesla’s second largest market, after the United States. Chinese automaker BYD reported sales of more than 416,000 pure electric passenger vehicles in the quarter, a 39% rise from a year earlier, once again overtaking Tesla as the world’s largest seller of EVs. BYD has pulled ahead ahead of Tesla in EV sales for a number of quarters in recent years, although Tesla has always maintained the lead in full-year sales. But Tesla is poised to lose that title in 2025, given current sales trends. BYD’s EVs are generally less expensive than Tesla, among other advantages. Earlier this month, BYD unveiled a charging system that it says will give its latest EV model 250 miles of range after plugging in for just five minutes. But despite the competition abroad, BYD and most other Chinese EV makers do not have a presence in the US market. This story has been updated with additional reporting and context. CNN’s Ariel Edwards-Levy, Juliana Liu, Hassan Tayir and John Liu contributed to this report. Correction: An earlier version of this story incorrectly stated the decline in Tesla sales. Tesla sales fell 13% last quarter. http://www...usiness/tesla-sales/index.html
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 02 17:50:53 "most other Chinese EV makers do not have a presence in the US market." That was a weird way of saying that there are 27% tarrifs on Chinese cars in the US
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 02 17:53:19 Sorry, 100% tariffs "it is effectively barred from due to 100% tariffs on its passenger cars."
Sam Adams Member	Thu Apr 03 10:23:09 "BYD’s EVs are generally less expensive than Tesla" Only if you compare little foreign shitboxes to proper vehicles. If you compare byds to other vehicles in the same class the prices are the same.
jergul large member	Thu Apr 03 10:25:53 Defunding Musk remains the Humanity's prime directive. Citizen Trump is playing his heavy handed part in this.
jergul large member	Thu Apr 03 10:26:13 Strike the "the".
Sam Adams Member	Thu Apr 03 10:28:57 But ya tesla has obviously made major mistakes. The gimmicky shit, the lack of flat roofs and spares, no v2x, no real truck, insane leader, the fsd lies makes it clear they are not headed for a rosy future. Ford GM and Rivian would all be well ahead of tesla in terms of useful EVs that i am looking at. Maybe even hyndai/volvo. Surprising to see the japanese failing at EVs.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Thu Apr 03 13:26:01 It’s all about SpaceX. Always was. And I bet that is what Musk is getting out of his relationship with Trump and setting Tesla on fire.
williamthebastard Member	Thu Apr 03 16:20:47 Excellent, about bloody time. "European Union regulators are preparing major penalties against Elon Musk’s social media platform X for breaking a landmark law to combat illicit content and disinformation. The fine could surpass $1 billion, one person said, as regulators seek to make an example of X to deter other companies from violating the law, called the Digital Services Act. E.U. officials said their investigation into X was progressing independently from tariff negotiations after Mr. Trump announced major new levies this week. The investigation began in 2023 and regulators last year issued a preliminary ruling that X had violated the law. X also faces a second E.U. investigation that is broader and that could lead to further penalties. In that investigation, two people said, E.U. officials are building a case that X’s hands-off approach to policing user-generated content has made it a hub of illegal hate speech, disinformation and other material that is viewed as undercutting democracy across the 27-nation bloc. X declined to comment. The X investigation has been closely watched as the first major attempt to enforce the Digital Services Act, which requires companies to better police their platforms and to provide adequate transparency about how their services work. https://archive.ph/https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/03/technology/eu-penalties-x-elon-musk.html
williamthebastard Member	Thu Apr 03 16:21:11 http://www.../eu-penalties-x-elon-musk.html
kargen Member	Thu Apr 03 17:16:08 what makes you think Musk is getting out of his relationship with Trump?
murder Member	Thu Apr 03 19:02:43 He's not. It wouldn't make a difference, and Trump is his main lifeline.
Seb Member	Thu Apr 03 19:14:34 Sam: "Only if you compare little foreign shitboxes to proper vehicles" Given we are talking Tesla, which produces vehicles that spontaneously catch fire, drive into trailers, lock their drivers in during an accident, aren't deemed roadworthy in many countries and whose latest product is currently subject to recall in its home market due to being glued together with defective glue... I'm not sure proper vehicle is quite the opposite term.
Seb Member	Thu Apr 03 19:28:01 As for spaceX, I'm starting to revise my view on starship. They've cut the payload dramatically, and several of the last launches have failed due to problems they already knew about from the previous failure but couldn't address due to production cycles. They are, essentially, hitting the point where fast iterative learning doesn't work because the build times are too long and it's too hard to change design. To keep their methodology they need to slow down tests; or they need to start to move towards NASA style lab by tests, scaled model tests etc. It's starting to look to independent experts who championed falcon that starship may be a turkey. Fundamentally to heavy and not enough safety margin, and not enough free parameters in its design to find a sweet spot that gives reliable success rates and reusability. And I think they're kinda fundamentally curtailed starlinks market share by weaponising it. Further the model of huge numbers of Leo sats is likely a liability. Recent studies indicate the high rate of satellite re-entries and associated Al compounds aerosolised in the high atmosphere is likely to result in depletion of ozone. I suspect in the medium term this will result in some kind of regulatory or consumer pushback.
Sam Adams Member	Thu Apr 03 20:24:34 "Given we are talking Tesla, which produces vehicles that spontaneously catch fire, drive into trailers, lock their drivers in during an accident, aren't deemed roadworthy in many countries and whose latest product is currently subject to recall in its home market due to being glued together with defective glue" The funny thing is this though: after all that its still a superior vehicle to anything made in britain, ever, by far. I'd include the EU too but some of the latest volvos look decent.
murder Member	Thu Apr 03 21:33:35 "As for spaceX, I'm starting to revise my view on starship. They've cut the payload dramatically, and several of the last launches have failed due to problems they already knew about from the previous failure but couldn't address due to production cycles." I imagine that they will get that thing into orbit eventually, but I don't see a moon landing in their future. -
Seb Member	Fri Apr 04 01:41:11 "A cybertruck is better than a Roles or a Bentley". Sure Sam. Sure.
Seb Member	Fri Apr 04 01:44:16 Murder: Probably, but it's going to be well outside the original parameters as a reusable by the sounds of it. Basically the gist of the last good article I read, they are having to sacrifice far too much payload for fuel and at the same time cutting engineering safety margins.
Seb Member	Fri Apr 04 03:15:00 I can totally understand how Americans might argue that they have some amazing artisanal cheese or beers. Sam is arguing bud lite and a slice of velveeta is better than a Paulaner or brie de meaux. This says more about his taste and standards.
	show deleted posts

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