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Utopia Talk / Politics / First they came for Parler
habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:01:30
http://www...-newsmax-citing-misinformation

Now House Democrats push to get rid of Fox News,OAN and Newsmax.
Rugian
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:12:57
You gotta love the balls on the Democrats to embrace this strategy. They can't get rid of the First Amendment itself, but they can try to neuter it to the point where it becomes effectively irrelvant.

-Congress censoring the free press? Totally unacceptable.

-Congress pressuring the companies that control access to the airwaves to censor the free press? Acceptable!

At some point this strategy is going to blow up in the Dems' faces. There's plenty of case law that states that when a private company is effectively acting a tool for the government, it becomes bound to respect the same constitutional liberties that the government is compelled to obey.

The government can't simply do an end-run around the Constitution by forcing private companies to act as its henchmen. That's a big no-no.

We're going to see a SCOTUS case that completely nukes this behavior, and soon.
habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:27:43
I couldn't have worded it better myself. Its a blatant sidestep to the Constitution.
habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:29:03
"We're going to see a SCOTUS case that completely nukes this behavior, and soon."

Are you citing a soecific case coming up? Or do you mean with all these shenanigans its bound to come up soon?
Forwyn
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:35:26
But Buzzfeed needs a WH press credentialing, lol
Rugian
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:35:51
I'm not aware of a case pending, but if Democrats do continue down this path then lawsuits are going to be inevitable.
Paramount
Member
Thu Feb 25 15:40:41
Maybe you can write to the U.N and Human Rights Watch and ask them to condemn the Democrat’s attack on free speech.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Thu Feb 25 16:02:37
so two representatives wrote to TV carriers asking questions...

it's hard to deny the continuing harm that's been caused by Fox News, they spent years trying to convince people all other outlets couldn't be trusted, & that they were the 'fair and balanced' outlet... then Trump kicked that into overdrive, now hoards of -completely- misinformed people wandering around (see obaminated)
Rugian
Member
Thu Feb 25 16:03:34
Again, you fucking invoked Trump. Shit up tw. Just shut the fuck up.
Rugian
Member
Thu Feb 25 16:07:17
Also let it be known that tw is now officially in support of Congressional censorship of the press by proxy. He came out and said it, it's caeved in stone now.
habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 16:18:09
TW,Now its just a few.Its not a big stretch of the imagination to see this idea gaining support.

Especially considering similar tactics have been supported in their shadow campaign, their own term, not mine (See the times mag article)
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Thu Feb 25 16:22:49
so Trump is unrelated to the rise of OAN, Newsmax & general spread of lies?

OAN in particular is nothing but poison

(& the 2 congress people didn't tell the places to stop airing the garbage, & they didn't propose a law to prevent the places from airing garbage, so kind of jumping the gun)
Rugian
Member
Thu Feb 25 16:26:25
"they didn't propose a law to prevent the places from airing garbage"

Utterly irrelevant and this response shows that you don't understand anything that we're talking about here.
Habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 16:28:01
They didn't pass a law to have FB and Twitter ban people either. But they used these sort of tactics to pressure them to ban the people they didnt like.

Again this is not only undisputed, this comes from confessions of the actors acting to help elect Biden.

http://www...-election-campaign/%3famp=true
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Thu Feb 25 16:31:38
they asked what the companies are doing (if anything) to combat spread of misinformation & other questions about what rules they have if any, etc

do you find it good for America that tens of millions believe any bullshit that a total obvious moron fraud clearly just makes up? & how do you think we got to this point?
Habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 16:43:55
Dogwhistles for mass censorship.

Ive seen enough from "fact checkers" to leave me.very skeptical of their findings.

It reminds me of a scene feom.game of thrones when Ned asked who set the two knights up to fight.He was told it was setup by drawing straws to which he responded "Aye, but who held the straws"
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Thu Feb 25 16:49:06
do you oppose warning labels on cigarettes?

given how many really stupid gullible people have been proven to be out there, maybe somehow warning them the stuff they are watching isn't actually 'news' is warranted... the level of misinformation around is embarrassing

not that these -2- congress people have proposed anything like that, just tossing that out as my own idea

the path we're on is definitely problematic
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Thu Feb 25 16:50:49
You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.
Habebe
Member
Thu Feb 25 17:10:01
Cigarettes are different. For starters its universally accepted their health damage.

Secondly we place it on all tobacco products.

This is singaling out certain media outlets that are against the DNC.

If Mitch did the dame to CNN and MSNBC , the left would have a problem with it.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Thu Feb 25 17:27:24
(Trump regularly did MUCH worse against every other outlet...)

here, 2 people sent a letter asking questions

and if there was some warning label law (which isn't being requested here) it would apply to everyone (granted figuring out how to do it & how to judge would be tricky)

i don't know a good solution, but given brainwashed cultists watch only those sources & trust them completely & those sources do not wield their great power w/ great responsibility, something needs done imo (these 2 congress people have not requested anything specific be done)

the hordes of grossly misinformed people is undeniable (even if you are a cultist as you probably believe the same about non-cultists)
kargen
Member
Thu Feb 25 17:28:59
"t's hard to deny the continuing harm that's been caused by Fox News, they spent years trying to convince people all other outlets couldn't be trusted, & that they were the 'fair and balanced' outlet... then Trump kicked that into overdrive, now hoards of -completely- misinformed people wandering around (see obaminated)"

How can you be so fixated on Trump yet so unaware? The majority of the hard core fans of former-president Trump were not and are not fans of FOX News.

And anyone that needs FOX News to tell them CNN, MSNBC and others are biased hard to the left are idiots.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Sat Feb 27 01:47:32
A USA Today poll found that 58 percent of Republicans believe the attack was “mostly an antifa-inspired attack that only involved a few Trump supporters”


...how did that belief happen i wonder

a whole party of misinformed cultists... great for America
Paramount
Member
Sat Feb 27 01:59:49
” Now House Democrats push to get rid of Fox News,OAN and Newsmax.”


”the media is the enemy of the people” - Trump

To censor the enemy can’t be wrong?
jergul
large member
Sat Feb 27 06:22:20
First they came for Huawei buddy.
Dukhat
Member
Sun Feb 28 04:14:38
@kargen

How can YOU be so unaware. Fox was Trump’s and his followers favorite news source for most of his presidency so much so that Trump didn’t even take the Coronavirus seriously until Tucker Carlson of all people broke character and told him to start giving a fuck on his show and then Trump, for a brief period, finally started giving a fuck.

As for them leaving, that’s a relatively recent event based on his election fraud bullshit.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Sun Feb 28 12:57:42
i'm pretty sure it's a big reason why Trump got so popular to begin with... he was always repeating the outrage/grievance issues Fox talked about, so viewers thought 'hey, he's talking about all the things our trusted news outlet amps us up about!'
Hrothgar
Member
Mon Mar 01 01:01:40
"Also let it be known that tw is now officially in support of Congressional censorship of the press by proxy."

American 24/7 infotainment stations are not press any longer. They are propaganda outlets to competing regimes which have turned capitalism into a system to manipulate citizens into becoming political party cultists.
Rugian
Member
Mon Mar 01 04:59:40
Hrotghar

It's really sad that you've apparently come to endorse the abolition of the 1st Amendment. You used to be a relatively reasonable fellow, but you've clearly gone off the deep end over the past few months.

Ironic, isn't it. For all your recent bleating about Republicans, it's people like you that are the greatest threat to American values.

Maybe stop watching CNN for a few months and you'll remember that people don't lose their right to free speech just because you disagree with them.
habebe
Member
Mon Mar 01 07:51:38
There is a reason people are turning to Youtubers for information.

I dont always get tonthe dame conclusion as Jimmy Dore, but he talks about a lot of important stuff that you won't hear much about otherwise.

I remember some liberal show was talking about "code phrases" of the Right like "Do your own research"-tye alternative is you just trust whatever you hear without question.
Rugian
Member
Mon Mar 01 08:08:57
Yep. If you only listen to mainstream press, there is a LOT of stories and topics you're missing out on.

The key is to never put your blind trust in one source - if you hear/read something spectacular, you need to follow up on it and do some research to make sure you got an accurate take.

That's where most people fail; they simply don't have the time or motivation to do all that. So instead they just hear what their preferred source of news reports and treat it as gospel.

It's unfortunate since an informed voting public is a great necessity, but what do you expect. Its not like our education system teaches kids to intake a wide and varied range of news sources.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Mon Mar 01 08:34:04
Rugian
Stop getting so dramatic and keep two ideas in your head at the same time. It is an actual problem that so many people are unaware that data is being agggregated and sold to others precisely so they better manipulate you to, buy their goods/service, accept their narrative or stay on their social media platform and watch ads. You are an ant vs a hoard of elephants and they are lumbering your way. You are practically helpless at the moment, even if you are aware of these things, it does little in the way of making it easier to deal with.

In the current environment, freedom of speech exists in name only, because we are all drowing in an information tsunami designed to pull on our stone age instincts, in what is an entirely opaque process occuring behind your forehead.

Wake the fuck up smell the bullshit and save the 1st amendment, you’re a smart guy. But wake the fuck up first and don’t knee jerk ”oh I see, you are the biggest threat to american values” to people who come with bad news.
Rugian
Member
Mon Mar 01 09:44:22
Nim

We literally have legislators who, while acting in their official capacity, are pressuring ISPs and cable providers to cancel access to news outlets they disagree with.

If being alarmed by that makes me "dramatic," then so be it. It's an issue worth being dramatic over.

I agree that the current way that many people procure their news is deeply flawed. Censorship, however, is not any sort of "cure" for that.
Hrothgar
Member
Mon Mar 01 10:38:06
Somehow I'm guessing Rugian wouldn't shed a constitutional tear if it was CNN threatened with being cut off. Which just adds to the point this isn't really about free speech, it's about defending an ideology that has wormed it's way into his brain to get him to build his self identity being linked to his political party.

Threats to the political party feel like threats to himself. It's cult 101 manipulation.

Partisan cultist mentality can't comprehend the difference between legal consequences for propagating falsehood conspiracy propaganda (lawsuits due to conspiracy of stolen election, Dems eating babies, seizing guns, new world order, etc...) vs actual 1st amendment violations (this station is banned by law).

Free market information carriers such as mentioned in the article are at risk of reaching a point of too much risk threat of being fined/sued into oblivion for carrying the propaganda on their platoform.
Rugian
Member
Mon Mar 01 10:58:34
Hrothgar

You are severely out of touch bro. I would of course be against that if it happened to CNN.

And yes, Congress pressuring cable outlets to yank news stations off the air IS a bona fide violation of the 1st Amendment - even if its not being done via a written law, its still a formnof government suppression of speech.

I don't know where you got this colored view of conservatives being Trump cultists. Most of the conservatives on his board are libertarians who have long held maximalist views of free speech long before Trump became president. Our beliefs have little to do with Trump.

Again, I am sorry that something in your life has completely screwed up your political outlook. I remember you used to be a pretty centrist guy on most issues. You certainly are not that now though.
Daemon
Member
Mon Mar 01 11:32:02
Now they come for Gab!

http://www.wired.com/story/gab-hack-data-breach-ddosecrets/

When Twitter banned Donald Trump and a slew of other far-right users in January, many of them became digital refugees, migrating to sites like Parler and Gab to find a home that wouldn't moderate their hate speech and disinformation. Days later, Parler was hacked, and then it was dropped by Amazon web hosting, knocking the site offline. Now Gab, which inherited some of Parler's displaced users, has been badly hacked too. An enormous trove of its contents has been stolen—including what appears to be passwords and private communications.
[...]
Y2A
Member
Mon Mar 01 11:46:17
gab is even worse than parler, they are basically open white supremacists on gab.
Hrothgar
Member
Mon Mar 01 19:56:15
I am still centrist. It is the right that has moved further away from even minded, thoughtful consideration of the world around us.

It has been happening slowly since Rush Limbaugh came on the scene, but really took a nose dive after Trump became the right's figure head. Now it's nothing but conspiracy culture, loathing of scientific critical thinking, and fealty to a continually dishonest, verbally abusive Donald Trump. And if you dare dislike him then you are a fuck'n socialist commie America hater.

I won't be a part of that nonsense and it deserves to be eliminated because it's destructive to our way of freedom infused life, which depends on facts and truth to survive. And wisdom and moderation in leadership to thrive.
Habebe
Member
Mon Mar 01 20:32:32
Hrothgar, By most measures Trump was very centrist.Its the reason he had support of a lot of labor.
obaminated
Member
Tue Mar 02 16:57:30
Lol, the Democrats actively deny genders exist, they are the ones who are against proven science.
kargen
Member
Tue Mar 02 18:23:58
"And if you dare dislike him then you are a fuck'n socialist commie America hater."

And if you dare like him you are a homophobic misogynistic nazi that should be put down like a rabid dog.
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