Utopia Talk / Politics / Man deported from US by accident

murder Member	Tue Apr 01 03:49:49 But not really. ----------------- ICE admits to an 'administrative error' after Maryland man sent to El Salvador prison Kilmer Armado Abrego-Garcia has legal status, according to his attorneys. A Maryland man with protected legal status was sent to the notorious prison in El Salvador following an "administrative error," a U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) official admitted in a sworn declaration on Monday. Kilmer Armado Abrego-Garcia who has a U.S. citizen wife and 5-year-old child is currently at CECOT, the notorious prison in El Salvador. The filing is part of a new lawsuit filed by Abrego-Garcia's attorneys who are requesting that the government of El Salvador return him to the U.S. after being sent there "because of an administrative error." In response, the government has acknowledged the error but said in a filing that because Abrego-Garcia is no longer in U.S. custody, the court cannot order him to be returned to the U.S. nor can the court order El Salvador to return him. According to Abrego-Garcia's attorneys, in 2019, a confidential informant "had advised that Abrego Garcia was an active member" of the gang MS-13. He later filed an I-589 application for asylum and although Abrego Garcia was found removable, an immigration judge "granted him withholding of removal to El Salvador." But earlier this month, Abrego-Garcia was stopped by ICE officers who "informed him that his immigration status had changed." After being detained over gang affiliations, he was transferred to a detention center in Texas. He was then sent to El Salvador on March 15. "Abrego-Garcia, a native and citizen of El Salvador, was on the third flight and thus had his removal order to El Salvador executed," said Robert L. Cerna, acting field office director for ICE in a sworn declaration. "This removal was an error." Abrego-Garcia's attorneys said that he "is not a member of or has no affiliation with Tren de Aragua, MS-13, or any other criminal or street gang" and said that the U.S. government "has never produced an iota of evidence to support this unfounded accusation." In response, the government said Abrego Garcia had the opportunity to present evidence to show he was not a part of MS-13. "Abrego Garcia had a full and fair opportunity to litigate the issue," the government said. "He had the opportunity to give evidence tending to show he was not part of MS-13, which he did not proffer." In the filing, Yaakov M. Roth Acting Assistant Attorney General Civil Division for the Department of Justice said the court lacks jurisdiction to review the removal of Abrego Garcia and said that the plaintiffs are seeking his release from Salvadoran custody by "financial pressure and diplomacy." Roth also added in the filing that there is no clear showing that "Abrego Garcia himself is likely to be tortured or killed in CECOT." "While there may be allegations of abuses in other Salvadoran prisons -- very few in relation to the large number of detainees -- there is no clear showing that Abrego Garcia himself is likely to be tortured or killed in CECOT," Roth said. "More fundamentally, this Court should defer to the government's determination that Abrego Garcia will not likely be tortured or killed in El Salvador." In the sworn declaration, Cerna said the removal was "carried out in good faith." "This was an oversight, and the removal was carried out in good faith based on the existence of a final order of removal and Abrego-Garcia's purported membership in MS-13," Cerna said. http://abc...land-man-el/story?id=120359991
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 01 04:25:47 Dont like your neighbour? That guy who's competing with you for the district manager position? You've been trying to date Kate at the office for months but you always see her flirting with Pablo from accounting? Put in a quick anonymous call and Bob's your uncle
Sam Adams Member	Tue Apr 01 10:11:44 "Abrego Garcia was an active member" of the gang MS-13." Lol oops.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Apr 01 11:04:45 w/ no proof of it
murder Member	Tue Apr 01 11:21:58 "Abrego Garcia was an active member" of the gang MS-13." Or not. We'll never know because he was denied due process.
Forwyn Member	Tue Apr 01 11:39:54 "He later filed an I-589 application for asylum and although Abrego Garcia was found removable" Sounds like due process to me
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Apr 01 12:07:59 he was deportable... putting him in a third world prison, not so much (the aspect that keeps getting ignored by R's/Faux)
murder Member	Tue Apr 01 13:51:33 "Sounds like due process to me" ... "ICE admits to an 'administrative error' after Maryland man sent to El Salvador prison"
Sam Adams Member	Tue Apr 01 14:09:43 So a previous judge ruled him deportable... a lib policy cancelled it and trump reinstated it?
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Apr 01 14:57:51 they aren't DEPORTING they are IMPRISONING people in a third party country shithole prison (that we then pay for)... that's people with NO charges, not even alleged ones, just if the always lying Trump admin decide on flimsy evidence that they are an MS-13 or TdA gang member (& by very widely stretching an old law) so yes, judges should definitely be examining it (rather than being impeached) & the supreme court should definitely rule against this insanity
Forwyn Member	Tue Apr 01 15:16:28 "Maryland man" "foreign gang member deemed deportable half a decade ago" Fixed that editorializing
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Apr 01 15:45:12 let's hope he's guilty of something (no crime even alleged... JD Vance posted he had traffic violations, so obviously that's at best the most they have if lying Vance isn't lying) to fix something i said above, this guy at least -is- from El Salvador unlike some of the Venezuelans imprisoned there based on shit evidence (& that's also not of crimes, just of being gang members)
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 01 15:47:23 Oh, there are stories of canadians being imprisoned by the Naonazi USA every day. Canadian TV producers are seldom members of El Salvadorian gangs.
kargen Member	Tue Apr 01 16:49:05 He should have been deported not deported and incarcerated. Of course El Salvador could decide to incarcerate him after his return on their own. The left is now saying well since you admit to making the mistake have him returned. Unfortunately for that guy he is a citizen of El Salvador so we have very little if any say on whether or not he will be returned. What is a bit puzzling is he originally claimed to not be a gang member then later asked for asylum with the reason being rival gang members would hunt him down and kill him if returned. If he wasn't in a gang there would be no rival gang.
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 01 16:51:41 "then later asked for asylum with the reason being rival gang members would hunt him down and kill him if returned" source?
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 01 16:54:31 to claim youre not a gang member and then claim other gangs are rivals would seem pretty brain-dead stuff, so source please. Dont worry, Ill wait.
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 01 17:01:18 Oh dear, did you completely make that up?
earthpig GTFO HOer	Tue Apr 01 17:11:39 Anyone OK with this has lost all rights to ever speak about civil rights (including that one protected by our 2nd amendment) or the constitutionality of, well, anything, ever again. This right here in particular is some bullshit: "In response, the government has acknowledged the error but said in a filing that because Abrego-Garcia is no longer in U.S. custody, the court cannot order him to be returned to the U.S. nor can the court order El Salvador to return him." also: " In response, the government said Abrego Garcia had the opportunity to present evidence to show he was not a part of MS-13. "Abrego Garcia had a full and fair opportunity to litigate the issue," the government said. "He had the opportunity to give evidence tending to show he was not part of MS-13, which he did not proffer." " You can't prove a negative, fuckface. If I allege that anyone here (or a neighbor that I don't like) is a member of this or that gang and the onus is on them to prove otherwise, NO ONE here could prove definitively that they aren't.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Apr 01 18:30:51 i'm assuming/hoping when they say they can't get him back, they mean just -the court- can't order him back & that the gov't just doesn't care to get him back if they actually can't get back the people they send there, that makes it exponentially more fucked up we just have to just trust they have 100.0% accuracy (when already admitting a mistake)... plus there seems to be other cases of wrongly identified TdA members now in that prison (& somehow the current regime & its Faux/fraudoshpere/fucked-up-o-sphere only attacks the judge questioning this)
kargen Member	Wed Apr 02 00:13:19 Didn't make it up but also didn't do the research I should have. I read a couple of articles that claimed what I posted. Had more time tonight and he did request asylum because he feared gang retaliation. His lawyer stated the retaliation was because his family refused to pay protection money to the gangs. So I fucked that one up by not digging more. tumbleweed I would assume we could get people back that are not citizens of El Salvador. This guy is a citizen so probably they would need to file an extradition request. That would mean he is being charged with a serious crime in the US. Looks like he isn't charged with a serious crime so not sure extradition applies. The government could argue on his behalf that he be released but beyond that probably not much can be done. Earthpig he is a citizen of El Salvador not the United States. We have no right to demand a citizen of El Salvador be sent to the United States outside of extradition for serious crimes. He should not have been sent but now that he is in El Salvador what happens to him is largely up to them.
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 02 00:51:22 "Didn't make it up but also didn't do the research I should have. I read a couple of articles that claimed what I posted. Had more time tonight and he did request asylum because he feared gang retaliation. His lawyer stated the retaliation was because his family refused to pay protection money to the gangs. So I fucked that one up by not digging more." Well, Im very impressed by that honesty, nice one.
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 04:55:07 "tumbleweed I would assume we could get people back that are not citizens of El Salvador. This guy is a citizen so probably they would need to file an extradition request." No. We are paying El Salvador to keep this guy locked up. All we have to do is inform El Salvador that we don't need the guy locked up and that we will no longer pay for his detention, and that removes any incentive for El Salvador to keep him locked up. At that point the guy can simply board a plane and come back to the US. El Salvador doesn't keep its citizens from traveling abroad. -
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 04:57:27 And the judge does have authority because he can find that the prison we have El Salvador operating for us violates US law and the Constitution ... and bar the US from transferring funds to El Salvador to finance it. -
Dukhat Member	Wed Apr 02 11:33:10 Cuckservatives: Individual Liberty and Due Process for Me but not for Thee
Forwyn Member	Wed Apr 02 12:32:26 Yes. Individual liberty for American citizens, not for foreign gang members. Freedom to protest in support of Hamas and other foreign terror groups for American citizens, not foreigners on student visas.
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 13:04:11 Maybe ... but due process for everyone in our jurisdiction. You don't know that this guy is a gang member no matter how many times you repeat it.
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 13:06:53 "Freedom to protest in support of Hamas and other foreign terror groups for American citizens, not foreigners on student visas." Also, it's fine to kick these foreigners out, but there's no need to arrest them as if they were fugitives from the law. We know who and where they are. Just inform them that their status has been revoked and they have X many days to pack their shit and leave. -
Forwyn Member	Wed Apr 02 13:09:21 How many times does he have to go to court before we say he had due process?
Sam Adams Member	Wed Apr 02 14:11:02 "How many times does he have to go to court before we say he had due process?" As many times as it takes for libs to feel good about resisting the bad orange man.
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 15:04:01 "How many times does he have to go to court before we say he had due process?" How many times would you have to go to court? -
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 15:06:51 "As many times as it takes for libs to feel good about resisting the bad orange man." As opposed to submitting to the bad orange man? Yes.
earthpig GTFO HOer	Wed Apr 02 17:08:56 "Earthpig he is a citizen of El Salvador not the United States. We have no right to demand a citizen of El Salvador be sent to the United States outside of extradition for serious crimes. " 1st, that's some legalistic nonsense. 2nd, we are paying El Salvador to incarcerate him, which incidentally is some international pirate mercenary bullshit. Actually, in this case, and this doesn't happen often, I agree with much of what murder said, so no need to retype it. "How many times does he have to go to court before we say he had due process?" I don't know; how many convictions is Trump at?
earthpig GTFO HOer	Wed Apr 02 17:26:57 "Yes. Individual liberty for American citizens, not for foreign gang members. Freedom to protest in support of Hamas and other foreign terror groups for American citizens, not foreigners on student visas." We need to have due process to establish if any of that, or none of that, actually happened. In particular, it's a well established fact that "protest in support of Hamas" is actually code for "protest against Israeli policy as it applies to Palestinians" at least 9 in 10 times it's alleged, so it's safe to say that 90% of deportations done under the guise of what you just alleged, are total fabrications and bullshit. Hence, the need for due process. And if you disagree with my 90% figure, and think it's more like 15% or 1%... hey, that's what due process is for, so you can prove me and the other "libs" wrong, to "stick it to the libs."
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 17:43:33 "Actually, in this case, and this doesn't happen often, I agree with much of what murder said ..." Eventually everyone realizes that I'm right about everything all the time. If I have an opinion on something ... I'm right.
Seb Member	Wed Apr 02 17:53:51 Forwyn: "Freedom to protest in support of Hamas and other foreign terror groups for American citizen" That's not factually true. The 1st amendment puts a prohibition on the state preventing it from limiting petitioning of the govt, freedom of assembly etc. It doesn't caveat that as allowing the state to do so for non citizens.
murder Member	Wed Apr 02 18:18:30 You have a right to free speech no matter who you are. But you're not entitled to be here. The government can deport you if they want to.
kargen Member	Wed Apr 02 18:43:57 I said something similar when Trump said he was going to use the Aliens Enemy Act. He doesn't have to use that act. He can just say they broke the law coming here so we are sending them home.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Apr 02 21:24:51 an El Salvadorian prison is none of their homes
kargen Member	Wed Apr 02 23:50:15 You still have the brain cells to type so I know you are aware that by home I mean their country. When we deport people we don't give them a Lyft to their front door. When send them home to their country.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Thu Apr 03 00:45:56 your post makes no sense then as he's not using the Alien Enemies Act to deport anyone home, he's using it to put Venezuelans into an El Salvador prison (which for some reason the cult & its media calls 'deporting') not sure by what authority he's putting suspected MS-13 people there too, but probably illegal as well as is his way
Seb Member	Thu Apr 03 01:01:26 As tumbleweed says, that aren't being deported, they are being sent to a gulag.
Seb Member	Thu Apr 03 01:04:31 The fact the gulag is in another country is irrelevant. It's Guantanamo all over again. Only rather than renditioning "terrorists" it's pretty much anyone that they don't like. And if you look at the arguments that are using in court they are opening up the potential in law to do it to citizens.
murder Member	Thu Apr 03 06:00:28 My understanding is that the people being sent to El Salvador are going there because they don't want to go home.
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