Utopia Talk / Politics / China hits US goods with 84% tariff

murder Member	Wed Apr 09 07:18:17 China slaps 84% retaliatory tariffs on U.S. goods in response to Trump China has pushed back once again to U.S. President Donald Trump’s tariff policies by hiking its levies on U.S. imports to more than 80%. China’s Office of the Tariff Commission of the State Council said tariffs on U.S. goods will rise to 84% from 34% starting on April 10, according to a translation of the announcement. This comes after the latest U.S. tariff hike — which brings levies on Chinese goods to more than 100% — took effect at the start of April 9. The repeated escalation of the tariffs threatens to bring trade between two of the world’s most important economies to a standstill. According to the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative, the U.S. exported $143.5 billion of goods to China in 2024, while importing $438.9 billion of goods. The Trump administration announced a sweeping new tariff policy last week, and warned other countries not to retaliate. Some nations, including Japan, have seemed willing to negotiate on tariffs, but China appears to be taking a more hardline stance and quickly announced a countertariff. After China’s initial response to the April 2 tariff rollout, Trump announced an additional 50% hike, putting the total level for import taxes on Chinese goods at 104%. “I think it’s unfortunate that the Chinese actually don’t want to come and negotiate, because they are the worst offenders in the international trading system,” U.S. Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent said to Fox Business on Wednesday after China’s latest announcement. “They have the most imbalanced economy in the history of the modern world, and I can tell you that this escalation is a loser for them.” The U.S. had already imposed new tariffs on China before it rolled out its full trade policy in April. China, along with Canada and Mexico, was hit with new levies earlier in Trump’s presidency as part of what the administration says was an effort to stop fentanyl from entering the U.S. The trade war appears to have spooked investors around the world, as global equity markets have sold off sharply in April. The S&P 500 finished Tuesday down nearly 20% from its peak, putting the leading U.S. index of a bear market. South Korea’s Kospi Index dipped into a bear market of its own on Wednesday. Stocks in Shanghai and Hong Kong are also down sharply since the U.S. tariff announcement on April 2. http://www...oods-in-response-to-trump.html
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 09 08:32:59 Its getting to be enjoyable watching the neofascists commit suicide (not through the suicidal empathy of their renowned conservative compassion). I suppose if Trumps ratings finally begin to crumble he'll soon start considering cancelling the mid term elections due to various emergencies he and his neofascist cohorts will invent.
jergul large member	Wed Apr 09 08:37:40 The US actually has the most imbalanced economy in the history of the modern world. China is only one of the 40 the US is claiming is most unbalanced against it.
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 09 08:44:43 Trumps strategy has since day 1 reminded me of my nightclub days and the corny, low-level tactics we used to use. Things like employing hot chicks in the bar/on Foxnews, choosing bartenders who are not the best in town but rather the coolest and most popular, surrounding yourself with not clever people but the local celebrities everyone wants to be seen with, giving special deals to the local Elons with money, all the same cheezy nonsense. Trump runs the USA just like a corny nightclub.
Average Ameriacn Member	Wed Apr 09 08:52:29 That will be the end of the Playstation, the XBox will dominate once again!
TheChildren Member	Wed Apr 09 09:21:05 say hello 2 medicine costs x4 rofl at eggs 18 bucks? that is nottin compared 2 ur medicine soon
Rugian Member	Wed Apr 09 09:52:31 Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump BE COOL! Everything is going to work out well. The USA will be bigger and better than ever before! THIS IS A GREAT TIME TO BUY!!! DJT http://tru...Trump/posts/114308272725981913
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 09 10:02:12 The Emperor walked under his high canopy in the midst of the procession, through the streets of his capital. All the Rugians standing by, and those at the windows, cried out, “Oh! How beautiful are our Emperor’s new clothes! What a magnificent train there is to the mantle; and how gracefully the scarf hangs!” No Rugian would admit these much admired clothes could not be seen because, in doing so, he would have been saying he was either a simpleton or unfit for his job.
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 09 10:09:37 EU vote for tariffs against the USA is approved, begins in 1 week
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Apr 09 12:36:50 fuckhead: " Based on the lack of respect that China has shown to the World’s Markets, I am hereby raising the Tariff charged to China by the United States of America to 125%, effective immediately... " & he's pausing tariffs for 90-days on most other countries (as he's in trouble...) he -could- have told countries they had 90 days to negotiate from the start, but why think things through?... he's never had any clear goal in fact (well two contradictory goals + some weird shit thrown in)
TheChildren Member	Wed Apr 09 12:43:31 caved lol
Paramount Member	Wed Apr 09 12:58:25 USA is now turning into a socialist country: US Weighs Farmer Bailout as China Threatens Retaliation Agriculture Secretary Brooke Rollins said the administration is considering plans to offer assistance to farmers amid worries that the US-China trade war will have a disastrous effect on American agricultural producers. http://www...-retaliation-threatens-exports
Paramount Member	Wed Apr 09 12:59:02 LOL
obaminated Member	Wed Apr 09 12:59:26 He had to threaten those countries to make it clear he was serious. 75 countries called in to negotiate and never did a retaliatory tariff. This is called winning. And China is gonna be wrecked.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Apr 09 13:16:49 yes, total victory! ... nothing positive has been accomplished yet, only lots of negative, but drink up that Faux/cult bullshit
Rugian Member	Wed Apr 09 13:33:31 I literally bought this morning. Up 8% right now lol
TheChildren Member	Wed Apr 09 14:00:55 reminder that u r still da ones payin 4 da tariffs...it aint chaayna payin 4 it. is u, mothafuckers. wut is it now, 125%? enjoy ur higher prices
Seb Member	Wed Apr 09 14:01:01 EU ain't going to budge on non-tariff barriers. They have said they held fire on retaliation because they felt the market reaction was doing the job and didn't want Trump to have a scape goat; and wanted to wait for the market to stabilise. They may now retaliate.
Paramount Member	Wed Apr 09 14:10:40 Did Trump manipulate the stock market? First he impose high tariffs on every country in the world that cause the stock market to fall. Then he tells everyone to buy. A day later he lowers the tariffs sharply, causing the stock market to rise sharply.
TheChildren Member	Wed Apr 09 14:13:14 aint nobody gonna budge on non tariff barreers... despite so called "negotiations" lol well maybe south korea has, but we have seen they a cuck nation so let me rephrase that shit, aint no noncuck nation gonna budge on non tariff barreers
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Wed Apr 09 14:13:30 It’s a fucking circus. But the clowns are in charge.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Apr 09 14:18:27 1 clown, nobody stands up to him, they just work w/ whatever shit they give him
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 09 14:37:52 Im reading that the EU has largely picked goods that EU consumers can avoid and find substitutes for. That also means in many cases that those US producers will have lost those market shares for good.
Rugian Member	Wed Apr 09 15:02:18 DJIA +7.87% S&P +9.51% NASDAQ +12.16% Lmao
TheChildren Member	Wed Apr 09 15:04:54 how much moniez u made? good! now u can use that moniez 2 pay 4 ur 4x more xpensive products!
williamthebastard Member	Wed Apr 09 15:05:16 "He had to threaten those countries to make it clear he was serious. 75 countries called in to negotiate and never did a retaliatory tariff. This is called winning. And China is gonna be wrecked." This is called the low-intelligence neofascism that is the real reason everyone ie abandoning the USA, because Trump will soon be gone, but the moronic neofascists like IWishIHadVitiligo who live in a foggy dreamworld of stupidity will still be there.
Paramount Member	Wed Apr 09 15:39:30 USA suggests that countries writes checks to US Treasury, to help the USA keep its hegemony over the world. Alexander’s tells about it in an excellent program: http://youtu.be/2jmB10WNMsY Alexander talks very slow so I suggest you play the video at 1.5x or 2x speed. USA must be broke and desperate if they are begging for money.
obaminated Member	Wed Apr 09 17:28:48 "Trump will soon be gone" it's his 4th month of 4 years rofl. And he is already dramatically changing the world. To the point that you eurofags openly think he is a bigger threat than Putin because he doesn't see a reason for us to remain in nato. As Bob Dylan said, the times they are a changing.
murder Member	Wed Apr 09 19:18:03 "Agriculture Secretary Brooke Rollins said the administration is considering plans to offer assistance to farmers amid worries that the US-China trade war will have a disastrous effect on American agricultural producers." That's every single day of every single year. There's always an excuse to subsidize farmers. They are the biggest welfare queens in the US. -
Paramount Member	Thu Apr 10 00:07:08 It is not fair that we have to run a empire and have to have military bases all around the world. The burden is very heavy on us. To ease the burden you can write a check to the Treasury. http://www...udson-institute-event-remarks/
williamthebastard Member	Thu Apr 10 01:10:35 So Trump shit his pants when the EU voted to retaliate and US bonds started getting dumped, eh? lol
williamthebastard Member	Thu Apr 10 06:24:36 EU's response: We took note of the announcement by President Trump. We want to give negotiations a chance. While finalising the adoption of the EU countermeasures that saw strong support from our Member States, we will put them on hold for 90 days. If negotiations are not satisfactory, our countermeasures will kick in. Preparatory work on further countermeasures continues. As I have said before, all options remain on the table.
Rugian Member	Thu Apr 10 09:11:18 You are *reallt* overestimating how much we care about the EU or what it does.
murder Member	Thu Apr 10 12:28:41 "While finalising the adoption of the EU countermeasures that saw strong support from our Member States, we will put them on hold for 90 days." So the EU is eating tariffs for months without retaliating? -
Seb Member	Thu Apr 10 13:35:16 Murder: The goal of tariff retaliation is to force a settlement. But it imposes pain on the economy of the country imposing the tariff (arguably more than on the country whose exports face the tariff for large economies like the EU). So why would the EU want to tax its citizens and businesses and cause them disruption if the US is already been forced to the table through the ecomic hit from their own failed policy? It's unlikely trade patterns will shift if a settlement is possible in 90 days, so there's little chance of a permanent hit to EU exporters.
Dukhat Member	Thu Apr 10 14:59:30 Just raise it to 1000% and call it day Tariff man. Your number will be so huger than theirs mein Trump.
Seb Member	Thu Apr 10 15:07:11 Kinda annoyed Trump backed down. It was doing wonders for 5 year swap rates and forecast BoE interest rate cuts. I'm remortgaging in July. Go on trump, fuck the US economy a bit more please! See, it moved! It's not dead yet! Hit it again!
TheChildren Member	Thu Apr 10 15:22:32 just anotha reminda, 125%, 14%5 or 250% is irrevelant it is da yanks that pay 4 it, not chayna. chayna laughs at this. go on, raise again. ur just raisin ur own countrys peoples costs lol
TheChildren Member	Thu Apr 10 15:24:05 go on then, 75% tariffs on medicine that means soon u gotta drive 3 hours 2 some town further up just 2 check 2 see if they got some medicine priced at 3x todays lol pwned
murder Member	Fri Apr 11 05:42:36 China hits back at Trump tariff hike, raises duties on US goods to 125% BEIJING, April 11 (Reuters) - Beijing on Friday increased its tariffs on U.S. imports to 125%, hitting back against U.S. President Donald Trump's decision to hike duties on Chinese goods to 145%, raising the stakes in a trade war that threatens to up-end global supply chains. The hike comes after the White House kept the pressure on the world's No.2 economy and second-biggest provider of U.S. imports by singling it out for an additional tariff increase, having paused most of the "reciprocal" duties imposed on dozens of other countries. "The U.S. imposition of abnormally high tariffs on China seriously violates international and economic trade rules, basic economic laws and common sense and is completely unilateral bullying and coercion," China's Finance Ministry said in a statement. http://www...ance-ministry-says-2025-04-11/
Seb Member	Fri Apr 11 07:52:05 http://www...e-best-response-trumps-tariffs This would be sensible. Capitalise on the collapse in treasuries and oversubscription of Euro denominated debt to fund European rearmament through ECB backed collective debt; and accelerating the Euro as an alternative reserve currency.
Seb Member	Fri Apr 11 07:52:55 Work with China and others to de-dollarise trade between eachother.
TheChildren Member	Fri Apr 11 08:52:09 "125%" >> wham! word on da street is, ur in recession alrdy that was fast!
williamthebastard Member	Sat Apr 12 09:59:29 When govt bonds get dumped, its literally called "the moron risk premium" in financial circles ever since Truss caused the same unprecedented situation in the UK. Interest rates still havent gone down since Truss. It was called that to denote leaders of a country that are complete economic ignorants.
murder Member	Sat Apr 12 10:06:42 "Work with China and others to de-dollarise trade between eachother." And replace it with what? Gold or bitcoin?
jergul large member	Sat Apr 12 10:46:13 Murder Automated, low cost foreign exchanges would fit the ticket. The whole reserve currency concept is a bit luddite frankly after digitalization.
murder Member	Sat Apr 12 11:26:18 It has to be denominated in something.
jergul large member	Sat Apr 12 13:21:33 Murder Sure it does. Here is an example of how it could work I put up a pencil for sale internationally. I decide I want to sell it in Iranian rial and set the price. You decided to buy it using Mexican pesos. You pay. The exchange from pesos to usd is deducted from your dollar account. I get the money exchanged from rial to norwegian kroner. Or whatever.
Seb Member	Sat Apr 12 14:17:27 Murder: Euros.
murder Member	Sat Apr 12 14:27:53 "Euros" That's what I assumed. But will the Chinese go for that?
williamthebastard Member	Sat Apr 12 14:30:58 Right now, China is pretty keen on improving market relations with the EU since the USA has basically banned them from their market
jergul large member	Sat Apr 12 15:20:26 Murder The challenge is mostly with balancing current accounts. China will go for that, but it will not accept a limitless accumulation of Euros as the central bank swaps yuan for euroes so chinese companies can pay their bills. So, investment matters. Will China be able to swap euroes for yuan again as investors buy currency for direct investments in the EU? Or is it likely the EU will freeze investments or even confiscate them at some point? But in our electronic world there is no need for a reserve currency. Buy in any currency you like and let the foreign exchange market balance it out. The main barrier is bank rent taking. Ludicrous the margins they want on electronic currency swaps. A legislative matter mostly. We do not need to let banks take excessive rent from trade.
Seb Member	Sat Apr 12 16:49:56 Murder: They go for dollars. Basically if they run a trade surplus, they need a vehicle to hold the savings, which in turn needs to be debt of some kind. Let's say you try Yuan, how does Europe earn all the Yuan needed for import of Chinese goods? It'll need to change Euros for Yuan, which means someone with loads of Yuan needs to swap it for Euros. What do they do with the Euros? Unless they are to have balanced trade with Europe, they need to invest those Euros. Enter Eurobonds to finance re-armament. Plus there's the trust issue. European institutions commitment to rule of law is far more solid.
jergul large member	Sat Apr 12 16:58:29 Seb The one with gobs of Yuan is called the Chinese Central bank. The EU deficit with China is about the same as the US. The issue is recycling the surplus. It the EU institutional trust higher than the US? What are you going to do with the frozen russian sovereign assets I wonder? The lithmus test so to speak :)
williamthebastard Member	Sat Apr 12 17:11:22 "Plus there's the trust issue. European institutions commitment to rule of law is far more solid." Thats why its called the moron premium. The usual state of affairs is that in developed countries, if you get a cheque from an employer youre pretty safe, but you never know; if you get a promissory note from a big company or a bank, youre pretty safe, but you never know; if you get a promissory note from a global company with the best rep in the world, youre pretty safe, but you never know. But when the promissory note is from the govt, thats the one thing you know you can take to the bank. Thats how it usually is. But when investors start dumping govt bonds, it means theyre saying, holy shit, this promissory note from the govt isnt safe after all, we need to move our money from the govt to something safer. When this unprecedented loss of trust in the govt's ability or willingness to pay is caused by the govt itself, it gets called the moron risk premium
williamthebastard Member	Sat Apr 12 18:47:54 And both times its happened, its been because of far right govts, Brexit being the UK version of Maga
Seb Member	Sun Apr 13 00:55:05 Jergul: You think the Chinese state bank wants to sit on a pile of Euro denominated cash slowly being inflated away? "the EU institutional trust higher than the US? What are you going to do with the frozen russian sovereign assets I wonder?" Hold them. But I don't think China plans to invade a European country while waging a mix of hybrid warfare measures against EU members. If it does, then obviously trying to facilitate exports to a European market it intends to fight a shooting war with seem a poor trade policy. Institutional trust has its limits, both ways.
jergul large member	Sun Apr 13 03:55:16 Seb Well, we saw the Huawei hysteria and then of course there is the chance Taiwan may become to brazen. A democracy has been attacked! It is probably safer to recycle by buying up Africa.
Seb Member	Sun Apr 13 10:07:37 Jergul; What's Africa going to do with all those Euros?
Seb Member	Sun Apr 13 10:08:07 Only place for them to go is debt. At least while China is churning out exports.
Seb Member	Sun Apr 13 10:09:09 I mean honestly it's great if China can persuade Africa to price its assets in Euros.
Sam Adams Member	Sun Apr 13 11:00:55 "there is the chance Taiwan may become to brazen." How dare those people live free of chinese dictatorship. How fucken brazen.
jergul large member	Sun Apr 13 11:12:31 Seb Maybe you can get Africa to buy EU debt.
Seb Member	Sun Apr 13 13:17:40 Jergul: Yes, that was the implication. It would be better than holding the cash, wouldn't it. Everyone's surplus is someone else's deficit - so as long as China continues to export way more than it imports in value, it has no real option but to buy debt, or pass the cash on to someone else who buys debt, or sit on a giant piles of cash depreciating in value. Especially when it's kind of fucked up it's reputation on FDI with shenanigans like buying up and shutting down industry.
jergul large member	Sun Apr 13 16:55:34 China's high water mark for currency reserves was in 2014 at 3,9 trillion. It has reduced that to 2,2 trillion. So is finding other things to do with its trade suplus than buy debt. Like buying up Africa.
jergul large member	Sun Apr 13 16:56:17 Then africa can buy trinkets from China. Rinse repeat.
murder Member	Mon Apr 14 00:36:59 It should be fun when Africa collectively tells them to fuck off.
Seb Member	Mon Apr 14 01:46:48 Jergul: There's a small problem with the rinse and repeat part. I'll leave it as an exercise to the reader.
jergul large member	Mon Apr 14 04:51:34 Seb Well, yes. One day China will own all of Africa and the recycling will no longer work there. What can I say? China is using FDI instead of building up its foreign reserves. It has been like this since 2014. You could argue that some loans qualify, but they are generally secured loans. Default and you lose the dam kind of loans.
jergul large member	Mon Apr 14 04:59:44 Here is a list that shows why the current business model is viable: http://en....umption_expenditure_per_capita I don't think we should arrogantly assume poor countries simply do not want consumer spending. There is in other words significant implicit demand for Chinese trinkets. The trick is globalizing consumer demand. China is doing *stuff* to globalize that. Feel free to cross-reference with gdp growth to gauge if it is working http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_real_GDP_growth_rate
jergul large member	Mon Apr 14 05:04:11 Here is one that removes population growth as a gdp driver. So a better measure of how consumer purchasing power is increasing http://en...._by_real_GDP_per_capita_growth
Seb Member	Mon Apr 14 06:49:13 Jergul: "One day China will own all of Africa and the recycling will no longer work there." Long before that, what will happen is the collapse in African ability to buy Chinese goods for political reasons. "I don't think we should arrogantly assume poor countries simply do not want consumer spending" Who is assuming that?
jergul large member	Mon Apr 14 07:11:30 Seb Well, one day. When Africa's gdp is significantly larger than Europe's. Have you checked population prognosis? All that is missing is fully including Africa in the global economy (perhaps a decoubled, two tiered global economy, but same difference)
Seb Member	Mon Apr 14 08:51:22 Let's see how that works out for China.
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