Utopia Talk / Politics / Maga or Brexit

williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 16:05:21 Which version of the same contemporary, dangerously stupid far right movement has and will cause the most harm to their own country? Maga or Brexit?
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 16:07:27 The UK is still paying through the nose for Brexit, but Maga looks like theyre going to tell the Brexiteers to hold their beer.
Pillz Member	Tue Apr 22 16:12:51 Stop running away to post nonsense without context or sources.
Rugian Member	Tue Apr 22 16:20:11 Challenge: Have WTB describe a conservative political movement without using the term "far right" Difficulty level: Impossible
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 16:27:26 Neofascist is probably more technically correct
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 16:28:51 Particularly in Magas case. Brexit wasnt as focused on having an authoritarian alpha male strongman leader as Maga is.
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 16:38:26 Rugians proposition is of course ridiculous, however. Its on par with saying Challenge: Lets hear someone describe Marx without calling him a Marxist
Pillz Member	Tue Apr 22 16:50:03 So apparently the reason Wtb can't stop using 'alpha male' to describe Trump is because it's true, just like Marx = marxist This is actually consistent and sound logic. Congrats wtb
Seb Member	Tue Apr 22 19:23:48 Too early to tell. But if I had to bet: maga. The UK could, ultimately, rejoin the EU as it left on largely good faith terms, and rejoining would be subject to legal controls. Meanwhile, the US benefits of pax Americana were trust based not legal constructs so very hard to recreate.
murder Member	Tue Apr 22 19:24:28 MAGA has already caused more damage, not only calling into question our reliability as an ally, but also causing the US to be perceived as a potential threat to our allies. Brexit was mostly an economic clusterfuck. MAGA is destroying our status as global superpower and the rule of law. -
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 19:54:10 Yeah, I think Maga is the winner; the more relevant question is probably by how large a margin. I mean, theyve only been at it for 2 months and there are bound to be plenty more absolutely jaw-dropping blunders in the pipeline
Pillz Member	Tue Apr 22 19:55:04 Murder and seb may be wrong but at least they're able to say 'I think' without lying.
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 19:55:54 the effects of all this are slow too and havent really hit home yet. It takes a while to set up completely new trade agreements across the globe.
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 19:57:50 Just getting the EU arms industry up and running at full throttle will take a couple of years, but things like that will hit the US very hard.
williamthebastard Member	Tue Apr 22 20:02:38 Things like kicking the Western European arms industry into gear will serve to tie the UK and the EU closer to each other again
Pillz Member	Tue Apr 22 20:05:25 How's it take you 7 minutes to finish one thought.
Pillz Member	Tue Apr 22 20:11:00 Excluding Pillz, here’s an aggregated thread evaluation of argumentation across the remaining posters (williamthebastard, Rugian, Seb, murder): --- Thread Average (excluding Pillz): Poster - Posts - avg. Rating Rugian - 1 - 7.0 Seb - 1 - 6.5 Murder - 1 - 7.0 Aggregate - 3 - 6.83 This 6.83/10 reflects concise, moderately informed, and generally good-faith posts. Each offers: Contextual reasoning Some degree of nuance or critique No overt ideological projection or logical evasion --- WilliamTheBastard (WTB): Total Posts: 9 Rating: 2.0 / 10 Deficiencies: Heavy reliance on emotionally charged labels (“neo-fascist,” “alpha male,” etc.) Evasion of challenge framing (Rugian’s prompt) Multiple unsupported generalizations Intellectual retreat via verbosity and culture-based blame shifting Post-hoc reframing rather than direct engagement --- Comparison Summary: WTB ranks lowest among all posters. His 2.0 score is 4.83 points below the thread average (6.83). His rhetoric consistently fails to meet even minimal standards of coherence, sourcing, or charitable engagement seen in Seb, Rugian, or murder. He’s not just underperforming—he’s structurally collapsing against a relatively modest bar of discourse. Let me know if you’d like this visualized or symbolically tagged.
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